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atomic drop to FIGURE-FOUR?!

AnubisPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:02:32

Okay, I'm running a match.  Everything seemed okay until the following happened:

Dalton goes for an atomic drop, but Mary Jane counters it with the Figure-Four.
Dalton's shoulders are on the mat.
Paul Pouliot counts: One, two, three.
A few fans are booing Mary Jane.

The winner is Mary Jane. Time of match: 0:07:04

Can someone explain this?  I thought it was a glitch, but upon investigation, I noticed that the atomic drop has the Figure-Four as a style-specific encounter for the Technician style.  I have not modified the counters or anything, meaning it came like that.  Can someone explain WHY?!

I'm pretty good with moves, and I know for a fact that no one could ever counter an atomic drop with a Figure-Four.  That's Matrix shit right there.

Maybe it's just a nitpick, but it's still kinda weird, ya' know?
xsouporheroxPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:08:02

Simple:

Sweep both of your opponent's legs, then lock int he figure-four.

Maybe putting the counter as double legsweep would be better, but a technician is more likely to go for a hold after sweeping the legs and there is no way to make that happen for sure without just making the hold the counter. Remember, wrestling, not spots.
Oliver CoppPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:12:12

This was a typical counter for Ricky Morton of Rock'n'Roll Express fame.

Flair would atomic drop him and Morton wouldn't sell it but wrap Flair's legs in a figure-four position immediately without taking him down first.
xsouporheroxPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:14:31

Or I could be wrong.
AnubisPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:23:51

On 07/21/04 at 07:12:12, Oliver Copp wrote:This was a typical counter for Ricky Morton of Rock'n'Roll Express fame.

Flair would atomic drop him and Morton wouldn't sell it but wrap Flair's legs in a figure-four position immediately without taking him down first.
That just doesn't sound possible.  Perhaps your idea of an atomic drop is off a little?  Here is the definition:

The attacker stands behind and slightly to the side of the victim. The attacker grabs the victim's midsection with one arm and hooks one of the victim's legs with the other. The attacker lifts the victim up over their shoulder so the victim is parrallel to the mat. The attacker kneels down and drops the victim's tailbone first on the attacker's knee.

So that means you do an atomic drop to someone from behind him.  Even if you no-sell it, how are you in any position to lock on a Figure-Four, which requires hooking both of your opponent's legs, while they're still standing no less?

I just don't see it.
Oliver CoppPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:50:38

We're on the same page regarding the atomic drop.

Detailed description:

- Flair (for example) gives an atomic drop to Morton (goes through with it)
- Flair, in doing the move, drops to one knee (left) while Morton is dropped on Flair's right knee
- Morton will grab Flair's right leg and put his own left leg inside and twist Flair's right leg in a four position
- In falling to the side, he grabs Flair's other leg - voila: perfect figure four.

You know you're really getting old when you remember spots from way back that people can't even imagine, much less than remember ;)
Oliver CoppPosted on 07/21/04 at 07:51:49

Also, this was a very popular tag team spot in the Blanchard/Anderson vs Rock'n'Roll Express (NWA) and RnR vs Heavenly Bodies (SMW) feuds.
Rick GarrardPosted on 07/21/04 at 15:06:16

man Oliver, I've been avoiding Ricky Morton specific spots in CW... and now you go and mention this one, which by the way, I do remember.  :)

He used that quite often in matches.  

Next thing ya know, you'll go and make WarGames matches recognize that there are two rings, and have the Barry Windham specific spot of getting stuck between the two rings during a match.  ;)
fettPosted on 07/21/04 at 18:21:59

HEYYYYY!!!

Might that be one of these hidden Easter Eggs?!?

"You'll notice because they are spots that'll happen in matches under certain circumstances. "

Just a thought
AnubisPosted on 07/21/04 at 23:43:21

Ah, well then maybe the problem is my idea of what constitutes a "counter".  In all honesty, what you described I would just call a natural flow more than a direct "counter".  When I think of a "counter", I think of a move that directly stops another move.

What you described is one guy no-selling one move and instantly hitting another, which happens quite often in TNM anyway. ;D

When I think "counter", specifically for an atomic drop, the top move that comes to mind is a bulldog.  One guy lifts the other up, victim shifts his weight and pulls down, hits the bulldog.

Thanks for the description.  It DOES make sense.  I guess it's all in the eye of the beholder.  Sounds interesting, though.  It made for a helluva finish, that's for sure.
Owen Hart RIPPosted on 07/21/04 at 23:59:11

On 07/21/04 at 23:43:21, Anubis wrote:Ah, well then maybe the problem is my idea of what constitutes a "counter". In all honesty, what you described I would just call a natural flow more than a direct "counter". When I think of a "counter", I think of a move that directly stops another move.

What you described is one guy no-selling one move and instantly hitting another, which happens quite often in TNM anyway. ;D

When I think "counter", specifically for an atomic drop, the top move that comes to mind is a bulldog. One guy lifts the other up, victim shifts his weight and pulls down, hits the bulldog.

Thanks for the description. It DOES make sense. I guess it's all in the eye of the beholder. Sounds interesting, though. It made for a helluva finish, that's for sure.
another counter would be the basic throw-off move, or even a cross-body when the opponent gets lifted