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What Happened?

TiLoBrownPosted on 07/14/08 at 17:10:48

For the 4th month in a row I forgot there was a TNA PPV. And I never think about watching the weekly show (almost like I never think about SD). But besides me, its seems others have forgotten too. This section of the forums sits dormant for most of the year. So I ask...what happened to TNA? How did it drop so fast? Wasn't this supposed to be the #2 company? It almost seems ECW is #2 now (combing Raw and SD as WWE). Does Russo need to go?
ZedjaPosted on 07/14/08 at 22:14:57

Just read the other threads and you will get the big picture..

And yes, Russo is a big part of it.
UnrightPosted on 07/15/08 at 15:52:29

I think it's generally because they keep using their PPVs to hype their tv show. Since you're not ordering the PPVs, then you're not jazzed into watching their free show.

Also: Russo's fault.
Kevin SullivanPosted on 07/15/08 at 23:39:31

Ok, we need to stop putting ALL the blame on Russo's shoulders. He's not even the head booker at TNA anymore. Jeff Jarrett is.

Plus the fact that Don West is ALMOST (I said ALMOST) as bad as Mike Adamle.
pszPosted on 07/16/08 at 01:56:20

Plus the fact that the "alternative" to WWE is a company with original ECW production values trying to emulate WCW using ex-WWE wrestlers.
AllPowerfulGARTHPosted on 07/18/08 at 13:45:37

PSZ is closest here, I think. TNA is trying to compete with WWE by doing what WCW did in the 1990s -- using ex-WWE talent and WWE-style storylines, hoping that will put them on an equal level with WWE, and then trying to put themselves over the top with better matches. But WCW had the bankroll to easily steal away top WWE guys like Hulk Hogan, Randy Savage, Scott Hall and Kevin Nash, whereas TNA can't use money to get WWE wrestlers; it only has access to the ones who are pissed off at WWE and are willing to accept a lower payday to work for TNA. Kurt Angle and Booker T are good, sure, but they ain't no Hulk Hogan and Randy Savage.

Besides, even with that massive money advantage, the WCW model didn't really compete with WWE for the first few years; it wasn't until Eric Bischoff had a big hit with the nWo and started looking to put out a separate-but-equal product, rather than just an equal product, that WCW took off. WCW may have used ex-WWE guys, but when it first started beating WWE in the ratings, it wasn't using WWE storylines. With Jeff Jarrett and Vince Russo, two guys who got their big-league starts in WWE (and who, for that matter, were part of WCW during that company's downfall period), heading up the booking squad, it's no wonder the company seems to think imitating WWE is a winning strategy. Unfortunately, like so much in wrestling, it more or less comes down to divine intervention at this point; TNA needs an Eric Bischoff, but you really can't know who's going to be able to fill that role until you try them out, and putting someone relatively untested in charge is much more likely to result in disaster than massive success.

WWE is more or less in the same situation when it comes to main eventers; the company has been looking for the next Stone Cold Steve Austin and the next The Rock since 2003, and guys like that don't just pop up out of nowhere.
pszPosted on 07/18/08 at 14:37:35

And TNA's original style was closer to ECW's original style: Be Different. Don't try to BEAT WWE, try to be DIFFERENT from WWE.

It worked in South Philly (and went downhill when they tried to compete), and it worked in Memphis (until they moved to try to compete)
TiLoBrownPosted on 07/18/08 at 18:36:01

At the time, Angle was the closest Hogan they had IMO....and Cena is the new Rock, Stone Cold...whoever the biggest is in the company
Memphis VicePosted on 08/10/08 at 10:11:23

If you ask me, TNA should:

1. Quit the country-music crossovers. Gives them a bush-league reputation, and panders to a dwindling market of fans that primarily can't afford to travel to shows or buy DVD players. Go look at your Billboard Top 10 Albums sometime. The country market is lucky to crack the Top Ten once or twice a year, whereas rap, dance pop and r&b dominate, with only the biggest rock bands and the occasional movie soundtrack competing on that level.

Pandering to country fans in 2008 isn't going to get any more buys than pandering to jazz, reggae, or classical fans....except those fans don't elicit Jeff Foxworthy jokes followed by a quick change of the channel.

2. Fire Russo and put Jarrett and Mantell under Jim Cornette.

3. Stop worrying about what WWE is doing and start worrying about AAA and ROH catching up and bypassing them.
Larry MondelloPosted on 11/14/08 at 08:54:51

On 07/18/08 at 13:45:37, AllPowerfulGARTH wrote:PSZ is closest here, I think. TNA is trying to compete with WWE by doing what WCW did in the 1990s -- using ex-WWE talent and WWE-style storylines, hoping that will put them on an equal level with WWE, and then trying to put themselves over the top with better matches.
I agree with this - the key word is "trying".  But to me comparing WCW and TNA is like comparing Red Delicious apples to road apples.  That is until Russo turned the WCW product into complete crap in the latter part of 1999.  I know we say that the blame can't fall squarely on the shoulders of Russo, but the reality of the situation is that anything Russo has ever touched has turned to crap as far as this fan is concerned.  I quit watching WWF in the late 90's when his fingerprints were all over it.  Quit watching WCW in '99.  Quit watching TNA a few months after he came aboard.  

Russo is a great idea man, but he sucks at following through and developing a story or a character for any amount of time.  I think that if a company were to hire Russo to come up with a good storyline, make over some of the characters, and then fire him one month later we might really have something good.  But this man is stuck in the Attitude Era where Crash TV, cheap shocks, shallow characters, and paper thin stories reigned supreme.  In two words, he sucks.

The wrestling in TNA also sucks.  I say this as a guy who really tried to like it and did for a while.  But the more I watched it, I realized that much of TNA's roster was little better than WCW Power Plant recruits.  The X Division, which TNA considers its crown jewel, is mostly a bunch of spot monkeys working your typical indy trash match, complete with poor selling and poor ring psychology.  I'll take Jeff Jarrett or Sting any day over these overchoreographed dances that they call the X Division.  It's just not good wrestling - it's impossible to suspend disbelief or view it as anything more than little guys performing impressive acrobatics.

A lot of WCW's success did come from stealing away top WWE talent, but notwithstanding WCW just had the better show to watch for a few years.  Bischoff and WCW revolutionized the way wrestling shows were written, and you can see the effects of that today.  They forced Vince McMahon to go back to the drawing board, and then it was WWE that had to adapt or get left behind.  And WCW always had the strength of a better in-ring product.  Even in the early 90's when the stories were wrestlecrap at best, there was simply no question that overall they had better workers and a better in-ring product.  It was really just a matter of matching the wrestling up with the great stories.

TNA aspires to be WCW, but they're simply not even in the same ballpark.  They have their audience, and that's fine - but I'm supposing that in 20 years or so we'll look back on TNA like we now look back on Herb Abrams' UWF.