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Memo To TNA (Impact! - Dec 28, 2006)

JakePosted on 12/29/06 at 16:42:01

Memo to the Memo-Haters: Hi, and thanks for reading. ;D
Memo to Sabin: Winking and pointing at the camera? Definitely not lame. Not at all. No, sir.
Memo to Petey: Did you just pop-up then hit a spinning leg lariat? You so fucking rule.
(I had some more, but I closed Notepad by mistake.)
Memo to TNA booking committee: LAX is booked as a dominant, gang faction, then beaten almost single-handedly by Spike Dudley? Vince just needs to sign the checks and you should have 'em in 6-8 days.
Memo to VKM: You mean the skits that DX stopped performing? The mutton chops that Triple H shaved already? The fat, oily, naked guy on YOUR PPV?
Memo to Christian Cage: What original entrance music.
Memo to TNA: Nice slap in the face to your workers by allowing Angle as a contender for Mr. TNA 2006. He's been in TNA for 2 months now?
AllPowerfulGARTHPosted on 12/30/06 at 00:10:36

On 12/29/06 at 16:42:01, Jake wrote:Memo to TNA: Nice slap in the face to your workers by allowing Angle as a contender for Mr. TNA 2006. He's been in TNA for 2 months now?
Oh, come on now. What says "TNA" more than a bitter ex-WWE guy pushed to the moon immediately after jumping ship?
AnubisPosted on 12/30/06 at 00:53:55

Memo to Vince Russo: Make up your fucking mind as to who the faces and heels are. We just had a clusterfuck tag team match with (heel?) AJ Styles teaming with (face?) Samoa Joe against (face?) Rhino and (heel?) Kurt Angle, and it didn't make a lick of sense.

Memo to Samoa Joe: Make sense in your promos, man. Angle already did beat you, so you should be saying "You can't beat me again."

Memo to AJ Styles: You'll never get the crowd to hate you as long as you're one of the top three workers on the roster. If you want them to hate you, start wrestling like Kevin Nash.  Being cocky won't make you a heel, just ask Rob Van Dam.

Memo to Jerry Lynn: Please don't take your shirt off again before you get in shape. Ric Flair can get away with that because he's Ric Flair. You're not.

Memo to Chris Sabin: Take some lessons in psychology from Austin Aries and Alex Shelley, please.

Memo to Jake (OP): Christian Cage's music is the only cool thing about him these days.
91Posted on 12/30/06 at 13:47:52

On 12/30/06 at 00:53:55, Anubis wrote:
Memo to AJ Styles: You'll never get the crowd to hate you as long as you're one of the top three workers on the roster.
This isn't true in the slightest. Look down the years at guys who have gotten great heel reactions - Bret Hart, Shawn Michaels, Kurt Angle, the Horsemen, Randy Savage etc etc. Granted you were right about RVD (who always did a good job playing the heel but his style makes him such a natural face that there's no point trying otherwise) but if Styles gives them a reason to boo, they'll ultimately boo. What Styles would need to do is change his in-ring style - and not necessarily to one like Kevin Nash (who did, at times, get decent face reactions in the past). But most of the high flying spots would have to go in favour of a more ground based orientation.
AllPowerfulGARTHPosted on 12/30/06 at 17:46:16

Indeed, the problem is not AJ Styles' workrate -- as 91 pointed out, many of the all-time best workers have been heels at some point in their career, and some of them are high-level heels now (Finlay comes to mind) -- but his high-flying that makes it hard for crowds to boo him. If the crowd gets the idea that he CAN fly through the air with the greatest of ease but WON'T because he's a bastard, that'll draw the boos.

On 12/30/06 at 00:53:55, Anubis wrote:Memo to Jerry Lynn: Please don't take your shirt off again before you get in shape. Ric Flair can get away with that because he's Ric Flair. You're not.
SLAM.
AnubisPosted on 12/31/06 at 00:38:14

Well I meant in TNA. The high workrate people have trouble getting over as heels in TNA. Even Petey Williams, at his height as a heel, got cheered because of the Canadian Destroyer. TNA fans just aren't traditional fans.  Samoa Joe and Christopher Daniels are other examples of people that just never seem to get booed in TNA no matter what they do.

So take my comment as TNA-specific.

Although I also think AJ Styles just doesn't know how to play a heel role well, it feels forced in my opinion. You know? Like he's trying to hard. Styles is a natural face, like Rob Van Dam.
Rick GarrardPosted on 12/31/06 at 00:56:05

All AJ has to do to turn heel is to grab Jarrett's guitar, act like's he's gonna el kabong Jarrett and then wallop the face of the week that Jarrett is facing and then hug a shocked and surprised Jarrett.  The fans would sure as hell boo AJ for that.
JustinPosted on 12/31/06 at 00:58:05

Or get a goon that no one in the US respects a la Christian & Tomko.
Rick GarrardPosted on 12/31/06 at 01:04:06

Justin, Bill Irwin is retired. ;)

And so are Bob Probert and Tie Domi.
HugeRockStar760Posted on 12/31/06 at 01:34:35

On 12/31/06 at 00:38:14, Anubis wrote:Well I meant in TNA.  The high workrate people have trouble getting over as heels in TNA.  Even Petey Williams, at his height as a heel, got cheered because of the Canadian Destroyer.  TNA fans just aren't traditional fans.  Samoa Joe and Christopher Daniels are other examples of people that just never seem to get booed in TNA no matter what they do.

So take my comment as TNA-specific.

Although I also think AJ Styles just doesn't know how to play a heel role well, it feels forced in my opinion.  You know?  Like he's trying to hard.  Styles is a natural face, like Rob Van Dam.
If TNA wasn't taped in front of an audience that didn't have to pay to get in, the results of the face/heel condundrum would be much different.

I totally disagree. AJ Styles plays a much better heel when he's motivated. Just because you can flippity flop around the ring doesn't mean you're a natural face.

I don't see how Rob Van Dam is a natural face. He's been absolutely stale in his "face" persona. He needs to go back to the RVD that wouldn't shake Sabu's hand because he didn't respect him, the RVD that spoke his mind and had mic skills, the RVD that made Jerry Lynn look like a star. I guess he's just limited in the WWE style.
pszPosted on 12/31/06 at 04:06:11

RVDs best work was when he was *SO* damn cocky and *SO* damn arrogant and *SO* damn sure of himself.... BUT NOBODY COULD DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

As a heel he worked because he'd always ALWAYS one-up the face (Sabu, Taz when he and Sabu went heel together, Whipwreck, etc) while dissing them on the mic or not shaking a hand or TEAMING WITH WWE AGAINST ECW.

He worked as a face because he had (in ECW) charisma, and put on a hell of a show.

In WWE/ECW he's basically Hardy Boy #3
HugeRockStar760Posted on 12/31/06 at 05:30:10

Rob Van Dam in TNA could be interesting. Although, I'm sure it'll just be the standard "WWE this and that" rant, start off as a face, and then turn heel.

I think RVD should come into TNA as a heel and act like he's doing TNA a favor, not the other way around.
91Posted on 12/31/06 at 13:11:06

On 12/31/06 at 00:38:14, Anubis wrote:Even Petey Williams, at his height as a heel, got cheered because of the Canadian Destroyer.
You sort of answered why he got face reactions right there. What I would have done would have been to introduce the move a few times and when people started enjoying it, he stops doing it (hitting piledrivers or what have you instead when everyone thinks he's about to do it) and only having him bust it out in desperate circumstances. Not hit it every week.

Joe wouldn't be a problem to turn heel either if you planted a huge heel turn now he was a big face - the best heel reactions often come off the back of a turn, rather than someone who's always been a heel and thusly gets cheered for being awesome.

On 12/31/06 at 05:30:10, HugeRockStar760 wrote:Rob Van Dam in TNA could be interesting. Although, I'm sure it'll just be the standard "WWE this and that" rant, start off as a face, and then turn heel.

I think RVD should come into TNA as a heel and act like he's doing TNA a favor, not the other way around.
This idea I really like - he'd come in with a big fanfare, everyone would be cheering because it was a big name WWE guy who'd jumped ship and then he shits all over them ala Brian Pillman in ECW (in spirit at least, not in content). It could work with anyone big enough to be honest but RVD's natural cockiness would work particularly well.
pszPosted on 12/31/06 at 15:16:29

*cheers for a minute or two*

RVD: Hold on, now, hold on... Everyone knows WHY you're cheering, and... You're right! You get to see (thumbs/crowd)Rob... Van... Dam.

*more cheers*

RVD: You're probably thinking, Wow! It's about time.... It's about time TNA got... (crowd chants Rob Van Dam, but he stops them with)... No no, that IS true, but what I was gonna say was... It's about damn time that TNA got someone WORTH watching, instead of a bunch of freaks in masks, guys who couldn't cut it everywhere else, and has-beens too beat up to move. I mean, let's be honest... This place isn't even a pimple on the ass of that Bingo Hall Wrestling I used to work for. You guys SHOULD be glad I decided to take a lighter workload and come here. I mean, look at <insert specific rant for his first heel-based-feud>
Rick GarrardPosted on 01/01/07 at 03:18:15

psz, that is very much what they could do with RVD... and what they should have done with RVD within the confines of the WWE's version of ECW.
AnubisPosted on 01/01/07 at 12:17:32

I think part of the problem is that, with the business being so exposed and internet smarks (including me) being all about the workrate these days, the definitions have changed. Since everything is so exposed these days, heels can't really do their jobs properly.

It's like now faces are "good workers" and heels are "bad workers". Very few good workers these days (at least in the United States) seem capable of being successful heels, and even fewer bad workers are capable of being successful faces. We've seen this a lot over the last couple years with people like Petey Williams, John Cena, Triple H, AJ Styles, Samoa Joe, and even Bryan Danielson to a lesser extent.

I hate to say it, but as much as Vince McMahon has fucked up wrestling recently, the internet has probably fucked it up even more. Exposing the business may make things interesting, but it screws up the dividing line. Hulk Hogan would never be over in today's wrestling climate if he were just introduced, and Ric Flair would flop as a heel most likely. Very odd. I doubt wrestling can ever fully heal from this wound.

Then again, does it need to? Japan is fairly successful just selling the in-ring product, and MMA is definitely becoming the next big thing. Maybe faces and heel aren't needed much anymore. Just like in soap operas, which use more middle ground characters these days, I think the face/heel divide may be a thing of the past at this point. What an epiphany this was!
91Posted on 01/01/07 at 12:39:24

Still not necessarily - three of the top heels on Smackdown in 2006 (if not THE top three) were Booker, Finlay and William Regal who are all awesome workers.

Also, I'm not sure if the implication was that Cena and Triple H are bad workers, but they're really not. Granted Cena isn't on the level of a lot of the TNA guys mentioned but he has a nice knack of delivering in the big matches and isn't nearly as bad as I've seen some people make him out to be. And Triple H can still bring the goods. Also note his absolute best in ring work was when he was at his peak of heeldom.

As for TNA, if they want someone to be a heel then it's up to them and the worker involved to make it work. It's not always possible to make the fans cheer someone but making them boo doesn't take brain surgery, even if they are as good as A.J. Styles. and it's less power to them if everyone keeps cheering him right after he's supposed to have gone heel.

Look at The Rock in 1998 - OK, he wasn't on A.J. level then but still pretty good and he was far FAR more popular, and they were able to take a crowd absolutely rabid for him and get them booing him out of the building in the space of one show. And all it took was a little planning and thought. And seeing as Russo likes to take credit for all that, he should be able to deliver again with whomever he wants.

As for saying the face/heel divide isn't really needed, perhaps there's something to that that is doable but then weren't you complaining earlier in this thread that it wasn't clear who the face was in the Joe/Angle feud? Just saying.
AnubisPosted on 01/01/07 at 23:42:16

Yeah, I complained about that, but mainly because TNA is trying to portray them as faces and heels and they're seemingly mixxing it up, as if they can't make up their minds.

Basically, they should go one way or the other.