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TNA's new aquisition... **Possible Spoiler**

americamamushiPosted on 11/09/05 at 02:20:15

It is rumored that Jason Reso a.k.a. Christian will be at the Genesis PPV and is TNA's new big aquisition.

If that's who TNA's new talent is then that could be a big deal for TNA.  Assuming they use him better than WWE did.
Rick GarrardPosted on 11/09/05 at 04:21:36

nah... he and AJ Styles will just end up fighting over their warm up/ring entrance gear that they wear.
americamamushiPosted on 11/09/05 at 04:27:19

If it is him what name do you think he'll use since he can't use Christian?  Jewish? ;)
Rick GarrardPosted on 11/09/05 at 05:46:15

Why not go with the net abbreviation for him and thusly make him top dog for the X Division...

Xian!

Or he could always return to his ECWA name of Christian Cage back when he used to team with Sexton Hardcastle... aka the guy we call Edge.
americamamushiPosted on 11/09/05 at 05:52:24

I thought about that, but if he did that I think WWE might make a stink about the fact that "Christian" is still in his name.
rey619Posted on 11/09/05 at 06:51:45

Christian would be easily the most over guy in TNA, and one who definetely could be a valid champion.
americamamushiPosted on 11/09/05 at 08:00:32

It'd be kinda stupid to have Christian in anything but the main event due to his WWE popularity and talent.  And it'd probably be smart to have him involved with the title at the very least.  I think putting the title on him would be a good move.  Christian is someone that I think WWE really missed the boat on by not pushing him harder.  If he really does end up in TNA he'd be a huge asset as the companies big face (though with the same attitude he had as Christian.  It really seemed like everybody really wanted him to be a face, but WWE kept trying to say "No, he's really a bad guy")
AnubisPosted on 11/09/05 at 10:06:43

On 11/09/05 at 06:51:45, rey619 wrote:Christian would be easily the most over guy in TNA, and one who definetely could be a valid champion.
Say what?  What are you on and where can I get some?

Christian is okay, but that's about it.  Honestly, I think you people overcompensate for WWE's crap here and give him more credit than he deserves.  He looks like a turd, his wrestling is above average but not fantastic, and his mic work sounds almost whiny.  I dunno, maybe he's just like never had a good character since entering WWE, but still . . .

Most over guy in TNA?  You gotta be on some serious hallucinogenic there.  Worthy of the title?  He's nowhere near the calibur of A.J. Styles, Petey Williams, or Samoa Joe talent-wise.
americamamushiPosted on 11/09/05 at 10:55:37

Since when has talent had anything to do with being over?

He may not do 1,000 variations of the backflip like some of the X-Division guys but he's a good worker.  He may not be the most charismatic guy in the world, but neither is AJ Styles.  

Honestly, I think you people overcompensate for WWE's crap here
I don't think anyone over compensates for WWE, but if that were the case you'd be just as guilty of tainting your comments with WWE hatred as we would with WWE nuthugging.

I'm not trying to start stuff, I'm just making a point.
rey619Posted on 11/09/05 at 11:30:43

Anubis, you need to get your wrestling lingo in order.

OVER means that the crowd knows who you are, that you are a familiar face. Even Billy Gunn are more over than AJ Styles, and don't get me going with Samoa Joe. No matter how good a worker he is (and he is possibly among the top 5 in the USA), extremely few people knew who he was before his TNA debut.

Styles, Joe and Williams are possibly better wrestlers than Christian (although your fascination with Petey Williams alludes me), but if you claim that they are more OVER than friggin' Christian.. then the question goes back to you. What pills are you eating this morning, and can I please get some?  ;D
Snabbit888Posted on 11/09/05 at 16:28:41

Having wrestling talent and being over are two completely different things, Anubis.  Christian is over right out of the curtain.  The X-Division guys are over midway through a match after they've almost killed themselves with a lot of highspots.  I like AJ Styles, Petey Williams, and Samoa Joe, but Christian has more star power than them at this point, by a lot.
americamamushiPosted on 11/09/05 at 16:37:36

Yeah, a huge chunk of fans still view WWE as "The Big Leagues."  No matter how much you like them or hate WWE, WWE is still much bigger than TNA is.  Christian on TNA is a bigger deal than AJ Styles, Petey Williams, Samoa Joe, ect in TNA because while AJ Styles & Williams are "home grown talent" and Joe is the "gem of the indies" Christian is still a major league player.

I like TNA and I like the guys I mentioned above.  I'm not taking anything away from them but you can't seriously say that TNA is on the same level as the WWE.  It'll most likely be a long time before TNA is on an equal playing field as WWE (hopefully it will happen though)  No matter how much you hate one or love the other that much is true beyond a shadow of a doubt.

Christian in TNA = Big fish in a small pond.  WWE never really utilized Christian's popularity.  If he's TNA's new guy then TNA has a nice little niche of WWE fans that will tune into Impact! to get their weekly dose of peepohol.
pszPosted on 11/09/05 at 19:22:05

Christian's popularity is very similar to Jericho's: Even though both were Heels, the crowd LOVED them. (Hence, they were "Over").

Hopefully (assuming said rumours are true), Christian can have a good, long, WELL USED run in TNA. They need it, he deserves it.
FormulaFirebird91Posted on 11/09/05 at 23:53:02

You know it's always funny to me what peoples criteria for what makes a good world champion are. It's funny because when you think greatest world champion of all time based souly on building this buisness... you think Hulk Hogan.  His matches were punches and a few scattered moves... usually getting in trouble then throwing a few punches... boot to the face... or body slam... and leg drop and that was it.

He was the most over man in the buisness and still is. I hear people complaining about seeing Hogan in the ring cuz he has no ability anymore...  he's slower yes... but if you ask me he's doing what he always did! Not only that he's still being loved for it. Don't believe me watch those live audiences.

The Rock... not the most inspiring of wrestlers was he? I mean honestly... he was good... but Chris Benoit or Kurt Angle he is not.

I know you see somebody like a Shawn Michaels and a Bret Hart and you say... well those are the kind of guys who should be champions. They can wrestle. (Though HBK has more than that going for him because he's one of the most fun to watch on the mic) but let us not forget when these two men were headlining WWF/E was biting it in the ratings.  When did they pick up? When somebody came in with that certain something and chraisma that lifted the crowd up on their feet.

Now Austin did have ability in the past with wrestling. But at the height of his popularity he was more or less a brawler.

Christian was on a huge roll when he was on Raw and this guy was getting mega huge. He was gaining momentum like most didn't think he could and he would have continued to do so if he hadn't been shoved the SD roster and then started jerking the curtain more or less. This signing is going to be big for TNA because Jay Reso WILL bring some fans along with him. There were a A LOT of peeps and even before he started getting big. WWE missed the boat on the Cena/Christian feud if you ask me. That could have been huge and could have really boosted Christians status with the fed.

Christian is a good wrestler... he puts on a decent match and he makes the crowd love him. The crowd was eating up his stuff and when you start to eat up a guys stuff as a heel... thats when the transition happens.....

Austin was a heel who people started to love because he was the anti-hero....

The Rock was a huge heel who people started loving because he was quick witted and put people down....

Christian was starting down that same path till they threw a brick wall in his way. Everyone knew it and there were a lot of people jumping on board the Peep band wagon. The question is how many people outside the internet world will realize the jump and watch TNA for it. I think thats the biggest question.

All I have to say is good luck to Jay Reso whatever they call him in TNA.  They could always go with Chris Cage... as opposed to Christian. Sounds kind of cool. :)


Snabbit888Posted on 11/10/05 at 00:57:21

I hear they're going to have him come in as "Chris Jin."  God that's stupid.  That's even worse than having Billy Gunn be "The Outlaw."  If he comes in as Chris Jin, TNA's both lame and stupid.  Stuff like that just makes them take a step in the wrong direction.
americamamushiPosted on 11/10/05 at 01:12:16

That's not just lame.  That's superhero lame.
americamamushiPosted on 11/10/05 at 01:20:24

According to wrestlingobserver.com (care of 411mania.com/wrestling) he has trademarked the name "Christian Cage."  A good sign.  Cause Chris Jin is fuggin retarded. :)  Since Reso trademarked "Christian Cage" do you think if he shows up in TNA with that name WWE will claim it's too close to his previous name/gimmick?  If they could make that claim with "The Outlaw" then I imagine they can with this as well.
PulsarPosted on 11/10/05 at 03:03:43

In all fairness to Anubis...slightly... I like Christian, I really do, but I just can't see him as the saving grace people are making him out to be. Is he over? Yes. Is he talented? Yes. Is he good on the mic? Yes. But I really can not see him as that guy who really ends up putting TNA on the map. In all fairness, he's not the nWo, D-X, Stone Cold, The Rock, Hogan. He's not going to be the one who makes people turn off their WWE for TNA.

But...I do love the guy, and now that I do watch TNA from time to time (usually the monday night replay) I am extremely excited about seeing him in TNA.

Plus, please do not give Christian a burden of making TNA a player in the game. Let's see how he does and follow it from there.

P.S. WWE nabs Frankie Kazarian, Kid Kash, Paul London, Spanky. TNA nabs Christian, Team 3-D, Rhino. Is it me, or is wrestling started to get more exciting again? Where you can kind of hope that wrestlers will be jumping ship back and forth again, like during the Monday Night Wars?
Snabbit888Posted on 11/10/05 at 04:07:20

I don't think anyone is saying Christian is going to rocket TNA to superstardom.  I think it's more saying that if TNA is smart, they'd push him hard, as he has the tools to be a steady champion that fans will know and recognize, and not make gag like Jeff Jarrett.

But there are rumors of Jarrett taking over as head booker from Scott D'Amore, so yeah, good luck on him not being champ forever.
FormulaFirebird91Posted on 11/10/05 at 04:21:08

Yeah just for the record... I didn't mean by my post that Christian was going to be the saving grace of TNA. Just think he makes the show more intresting and could carry that world title and people would like seeing it.

I agree with you Pulsar... its getting a lot more interesting lately. Definately talent going back and forth. Be interesting to see what would happen if someone like Benoit and maybe Jericho were to go to TNA as well. Obviously nobody knows what Jericho is going to do but with Benoits contract coming up... it'd be interesting to see. Because there are a lot of cult followings behind a lot of these guys. Most notably Team 3D, Christian, Jericho and Benoit. That'd at least help to boost the ratings a little you'd think.
Rick GarrardPosted on 11/10/05 at 04:40:58

The thing with the ratings is that the rabid hardcore following is already watching TNA, while the casual fans can't be bothered with watching wrestling on Saturday nights as was proven with the consistently slipping ratings of WCW Saturday Night over it's 21 year run on TBS.  ECW was the exception to the Saturday rule in recent years but then again they were on at 1am on SportsChannel and also had a cult following much like what RoH is currently experiencing.

I'm all for TNA running its shows, but I didn't know a thing about it's live Spike show last week until after it had already aired.  And that's coming from someone that actually cares about their product but never gets to see the Saturday shows.  At least with the old Friday afternoon show, I'd get to see the replay later in the week on Fox Sports Net.  They really need to market their shows better in the mainstream such as newspaper and TV ads.  Just because they have radio ads during Ron Barr's nightly radio show, doesn't equal viewership, because Ron Barr is just slightly above Mark Madden on the sports writer/commentator food chain, even if Barr usually makes points just for argument's sake even if he doesn't have a clue to what he is talking about.
FormulaFirebird91Posted on 11/10/05 at 10:50:10

Yeah thats probably true about the ratings Rick. I didn't think about the fact that most die hards already are watching it. They really do need some better national advertising or something. I liked how during the Thursday night show they were telling people to call their friends to watch. I told one of mine over the computer he should turn it on and I think he did. lol But honestly they need to come up with a better way to promote it all as you said.

Though according to the ratings from that show people were turning it off towards the end... but I have to wonder if it was cuz everybody saw the Jarrett thing coming a mile away and just didn't want to see it again. I mean I know Anubis will say they righted a wrong there... which may or may not be true... but honestly I can only take seeing the same thing so many times and if the main people watching as of now are die hards of TNA they've seen this same thing how many times. So I wonder if the ratings are reflecting that the rest of the show didn't interest them... or was it just they don't care about Jarrett or Rhino so lets turn it off when it gets to the main event. Or even that we know Jarretts going to win so whats the point?

Cuz honestly I don't see how anyone could have watched that 6 man x-division tag match and said... this blows i'm turning it off. lol But thats just me. :)

-FF91
Rick GarrardPosted on 11/10/05 at 15:21:58

It's probably because of the ineptitude of the production crew that showed that at the next TNA PPV that NWA World Champion Jeff Jarrett would be defending the title, when in fact, he was challenging Rhino for said title later the same night on the live Spike show.  Small production slipups can hurt in the biggest way.  And it's not like Jeff Jarrett is Mick Foley (the night that Tony Schiavone killed WCW's ratings war winning streak comes to mind).
FormulaFirebird91Posted on 11/10/05 at 21:33:02

Every time I hear Schivone's name I want to do something violent. lol  But I'm still glad of that night.  It was the greatest night in wrestling history. :)

I somehow missed the ad saying that. I forgot about that happening so yeah I'm sure that had a lot to do with it. Then again I didn't need the ad to tell me who was going to win. I pretty much figured it from the time the rematch was announced.

AnubisPosted on 11/12/05 at 23:13:52

On 11/09/05 at 11:30:43, rey619 wrote:OVER means that the crowd knows who you are, that you are a familiar face.
No, OVER means you are POPULAR.

I know Christian is more well-known than A.J. Styles and company, but sorry, I seriously doubt he will appear on TNA and instantly be more popular than the likes of A.J. Styles and some others.

Will he be more over than Jarrett?  No doubt, and rightfully so.  That doesn't make hism the right champion, though.  They need someone that's over AND credible, and Christian would be as credible a world champion as Rey Mysterio.  Sorry, not buying it.
rey619Posted on 11/13/05 at 00:12:10

On 11/12/05 at 23:13:52, Anubis wrote:No, OVER means you are POPULAR.
No, not in the sense you think it is. If that's the idea, only faces are over, and only faces can be champions. That's not true, as the best champions are normally heel champions. Either way, the easiest way to figure this out is to see if Christian shows up at Genesis. If Christian doesn't get more pops than AJ, I'll bow in the dust for you Anubis.

I know you think AJ Styles, Samoa Joe and Petey Williams are the saviors of wrestling as we know it. That's fine, AJ and Joe are my two favorite wrestlers as well. But I don't want to see them near the HEAYVWEIGHT TITLE (except for Joe..) The x-guys are sooo much better off in their own division. What would you like to see? AJ Styles vs Christopher Daniels for the X-Division Title? Or AJ Styles vs MOnty BRown for the Heavyweight title? The X-Division title is far more important to TNA than even the IC and US titles are in WWE. THe X-DIvision title match have been the main event at least two times this year. Heck, even the Tag-Team title match has reached main event status.
John ProulxPosted on 11/13/05 at 03:21:42

No, OVER means you are POPULAR.

No, not in the sense you think it is.
More precisely, "over" means that one gets big reactions, whether that be cheers or boos. The bigger the reaction, the more "over" one can be said to be. Of course, there are different ways in which one can be over, and I could probably write a treatise on that...
rey619Posted on 11/13/05 at 10:02:40

Yes, precisely.. you can be UNPOPULAR as well, and still be over (see JBL). Some, like Jarrett, is possibly unpopular in a non-good way..
AnubisPosted on 11/13/05 at 20:51:52

That's what I mean.  My point was that it's got nothing to do with his "well-known" you are, but rather how popular you are, be it as a face or heel.  We all know that heels are booed because they're good at it.

As for Christian, first off, I won't be able to see the PPV.  Second, his "debut" reaction is not a good way to see how over he is because crowds always go crazy for any new person they like who's from a bigger company.  The way to see if he's over is his normal reactions over the next couple weeks compared to A.J., not his "debut" reaction, we all know he'll likely get the biggest pop of the night (or biggest boos), depending on whether he runs in for or against Jarrett.  So wait and see if he can MAINTAIN the reactions after his first appearance, then you'll know.

I'm betting A.J. will get bigger reactions overall.  I will admit Petey Williams probably isn't as over, same for Samoa Joe.

As for the X Division, I'm almost starting to consider the X Division their top tier, as opposed to the Heavyweight Division, so yeah.
rey619Posted on 11/13/05 at 21:43:26

I think we have toned in on the same wavelength now  ;D

I still think Christian has the potential to be the top face or top heel though, as I feel he has the best mic skills in TNA. I guess we'll see in a month or two.
ZedjaPosted on 11/14/05 at 14:30:37

Actually I'd like to see him do some stuff with Jeff Hardy, just for old times sake.. And yes he was at the Genesis PPV..
JoeDesertratPosted on 01/02/06 at 08:22:13

If that's the idea, only faces are over, and only faces can be champions. That's not true, as the best champions are normally heel champions.
I can't agree with this at all. It's hard to think of a single heel champion that I couldn't wait to see disappear. Triple H? Jeff Jarrett? Most people want to see a Hogan, an Austin, a Rock, a Foley or someone similar as champion. Generally wrestling has always been most fun when a face is battling the odds to once again emerge as champion. Hogan made a career of it. Maybe Rick Flair could pull off the heel champion bit but few others can. Most heel champions have existed simply to build a following for a hero face to challenge and win the title. Both the WWE with HHH and TNA with Jeff Jarrett forgot this point and I think it has hurt them. WCW forgot this and it killed them. Certainly, if the WWE had a serious challenger they would have had to drop HHH or lose out. And how many people thought it was necessary to watch Smackdown while JBL was champ?
91Posted on 01/02/06 at 14:09:27

What about Hulk Hogans heel run? What about Bret Hart in 1997? What about Kurt Angle? Vader - you forgot Vader held the title for most of an eighteen month span and did a very nice job. Triple H, sorry but even if anyone thinks he's overdone now, he was drawing five years ago (even the show where he defended against Taka Michinoku had a high audience). What about back in the early days with guys like Superstar Billy Graham and Harley Race? There are plenty of great heel champions, you've just got to know where to look.
Rick GarrardPosted on 01/02/06 at 14:52:57

The biggest problem with having a heel champion is that you have to have credible faces and there is a big lack of those right now.  The nWo made everyone want to not just be a heel, but a "cool heel", which kills the whole face vs heel premise that wrestling is based around.  Part of the problem is that guys jump from heel to face and back again and again to the point where the casual fan is so confused that it turns them away.  Sadly we'll never see the likes of guys like Rick Rude, who worked almost his entire career (except for his ECW announcing stint) as a heel or a Ricky Steamboat that worked his entire career as a face.  And in both cases, had either ever made the big turn, they would have probably had mega-reactions, much like the night that Hogan went heel in WCW to join "his" nWo, even if it was Hall and Nash that made it and Hogan was just riding their coat tails.

It was the night that Vince McMahon ushered in the Attitude Era by saying that instead of having good vs bad, black hat vs white hat (so to speak), they were moving more toward several shades of grey to make it more real and to better represent the athletes personalities.  It was that night that killed the good vs bad passion play in pro wrestling in the big companies in the US.  No one wants to or is shown how to play the true heel or true face anymore.  Everyone wants to be the nWo like "cool heel" or the Steve Austin like "badass babyface".

Edge and HHH are two of the guys that actually "get it".  Edge is mega-heel right now and has no redeeming qualities to his in-ring persona, the way a really truly great heel is supposed to be.  HHH is such a bastard heel that he pisses people off just by mere mention of his name, especially on the internet, even if most criticisms of his work are unwarranted.  (I personally think most people are pissed  at him because every time he makes a comeback from a rehabbed injury, he comes back to cheers and by the end of the night of his return, he has alienated every fan in the building to wanting rip him limb from limb)  Ah the beauty of a swerve~!.

Unfortunately there are really no true faces at all in WWE right now.  And when the faces break more rules than the heels, how can they really be a face?