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FORUM HOME > Wrestling > Puroresu
the famous Liger vs Muta match from 1996
| LillaThrilla | Posted on 08/09/07 at 06:02:35 The one where Muta rips off Liger's mask but he's got facepaint underneath and goes into Muta-esk mode. WTF is up with Muta no selling practically everything in the match? Was it part of Muta's gimmick to no-sell? It's a really neat match with Liger's mid-match gimmick switch and everything. Plus Muta is the first guy I've ever seen stall and actually have it enhance the oddness and heelishness of his character. Usually a guy bailing during a match is just annoying. The bit early in the match where Muta slithers backwards out of the ring then turns his back on Liger as if to taunt Liger only to suddenly grab the guardrail and shake it to freak out the crowd is great. That'd never work anymore in the US. Really, that match compared to Muta's late 90s appearances in WCW are night and day - he's strange and sinister and it just oozes out of him, rather than being some random Japanese dude with facepaint that blows mist. |
| 91 | Posted on 08/30/07 at 20:55:47 I've never seen it but I've heard about it and the no-selling. I know no-selling is more common in Japan, plus Muta was quite a bit bigger of course, but I've been lead to believe that it was a lot more obvious in this match. |
| LillaThrilla | Posted on 08/30/07 at 23:31:46On 08/30/07 at 20:55:47, 91 wrote:I've never seen it but I've heard about it and the no-selling. I know no-selling is more common in Japan, plus Muta was quite a bit bigger of course, but I've been lead to believe that it was a lot more obvious in this match.I haven't seen much Puro so I can't really compare the amount of no-selling to that. It's odd that Puro would have more no-selling given that wrestling is more respected over there and it seems to me that no-selling or poor selling usually shows a lack of talent on your part or lack of respect for your opponent (maybe that's the point?), unless its gimmick-related no selling (which I suppose could make sense with Great Muta?). |
| Mr. Ken Kennedy | Posted on 08/30/07 at 23:34:32On 08/30/07 at 23:31:46, LillaThrilla wrote:Overselling is just as bad as no-selling |
| BULLY | Posted on 08/30/07 at 23:38:32 Blatant no-selling has little to do with talent, it's usually part of a gimmick or the story of the match itself. Lots of people hate no-selling, which is fine, but it's not because they're "bad" wrestlers. Bad selling has to do with talent. No-selling in Japan has a lot to do with "fighting spirit" and such, especially in AJPW where'd they do the move/no-sell/move/no-sell/etc until they both fall down. I've seen western nerds complain about it all the time, but the crowds would go nuts for it. As for the match at-hand, been a while since I've seen it, but it definitely had more no-selling than you'd be used to in 1990s NJPW. I think overall it had to do with the match itself--Muta and Lyger just destroying each other, and partly gimmick for Muta. |
| BULLY | Posted on 08/30/07 at 23:39:53On 08/30/07 at 23:34:32, Mr. Ken Kennedy wrote:Hennig selling > * HBK selling > * Rock's Stunner Sell > * (MVP did a pretty good flop at SS.) Hall's Stunner Sell > * I get why some people have issues with overselling, but for some reason I always enjoy it. |
| Mr. Ken Kennedy | Posted on 08/30/07 at 23:56:50On 08/30/07 at 23:39:53, BULLY wrote:So you think it looks right when say a guy the size of say Andre The Giant sells a high cross body from a guy the size of Rey Mysterio? (just an example) |
| Unright | Posted on 08/31/07 at 00:12:34 I like overselling... but I feel it can limit people. Hennig's a perfect example. He became the guy that helped other people look like World Champions because of how powerful he made their moves look, but he never got the World Title himself. |
| BULLY | Posted on 08/31/07 at 00:23:42On 08/30/07 at 23:56:50, Mr. Ken Kennedy wrote:what. |
| BULLY | Posted on 08/31/07 at 00:24:48On 08/31/07 at 00:12:34, Unright wrote:I like overselling... but I feel it can limit people. Hennig's a perfect example. He became the guy that helped other people look like World Champions because of how powerful he made their moves look, but he never got the World Title himself.Yeah, but on the other hand, it hasn't ever limited HBK. And Hennig had the AWA World Title! :P |
| psz | Posted on 08/31/07 at 01:22:20 This match? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=us1GTlbWgIU |
| LillaThrilla | Posted on 08/31/07 at 05:03:32On 08/31/07 at 01:22:20, psz wrote:This match?That's the one. |
| psz | Posted on 08/31/07 at 14:06:55 It is a good match, it really is. I'd like to point out, too, that Muta's character was always very... Anime-ish. If you look at most anime, the Bad Guys always "no-sells" through 2/3 of a fight no matter how powerful the Good Guy is, until the Good Guy hit a weak spot or a special move.. Then it became a REAL fight. Muta's character is similar. (Taz's character in ECW as a heel was similar as well, though he was more of a "No Sell And Completely Destroy The Opponent" type) |
| Mr. Ken Kennedy | Posted on 09/02/07 at 00:12:00 What I was try to say was that people expect big men to no sell on occasion. I think no-selling does add to a match sometimes, but only in moderation. However I do have a huge problem with cruiserweight who no-sell and also with people no-selling chair shots. |
| Some ARSEHOLE Stole My HAM | Posted on 11/06/07 at 02:37:32On 08/31/07 at 00:12:34, Unright wrote:I like overselling... but I feel it can limit people. Hennig's a perfect example. He became the guy that helped other people look like World Champions because of how powerful he made their moves look, but he never got the World Title himself.I know this is an old post, but doesn't the AWA World Title count? |
| psz | Posted on 11/06/07 at 03:46:29 NOW? No, I'd say not. Back then? Definately. It was one of "The Big Three" (along with WWF and NWA) |