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Next weekend...

Critic of the DawnPosted on 10/30/04 at 02:29:21

As most of you have probably heard, next weekend will be a big one for indy wrestling. Ring of Honor will be presenting its Weekend of Thunder shows on Friday and Saturday hilighted by the ROH debut of Jushin "Thunder" Liger. And on Sunday, NWA-TNA will be holding its first 3 hour Sunday Night PPV featuring Jeff Hardy vs. Jeff Jarrett in a ladder match.

Here are the three cards thus far in chronological order.

Weekend of Thunder Night One 11/5/04 in Boston, MA:

Homicide vs. Izzy vs. Angel Dust vs. Fast Eddie in a Four Corner Survival Match

Ace Steel vs. Jimmy Rave w/ Prince Nana & The Embassy

Low Ki vs. Chad Collyer

The Carnage Crew (Loc & Devito) vs. Mick Foley's Ring of Hardcore (Dan Maff & BJ Whitmer) in a Boston Street Fight

CM Punk vs. Austin Aries

ROH Tag Team Champions The Havana Pitbulls (Ricky Reyes & Rocky Romero) w/ Julius Smokes vs. Jack Evans & Roderick Strong of Generation Next for the Tag Team Titles

ROH Champion Samoa Joe & Jay Lethal vs. Pure Wrestling Champion John Walters & Nigel McGuinness

And the main event:
Jushin "Thunder" Liger vs. American Dragon

Plus Homicide, Special K, Allison Danger, Dunn & Marcos, Fast Eddie, etc

Weekend of Thunder Night Two 11/6/04 from Elizabeth, NJ:

Jimmy Rave w/ Prince Nana vs. Jay Lethal

The Ring Crew Express (Dunn & Marcos) vs. Special K (Dixie & Angel Dust)

Chad Collyer vs. Nigel McGuinness in a Technical Challenge

Trent Acid vs. Jack Evans vs. Izzy vs. Fast Eddie in a High-Flyers Four Corner Survival Match

The Second City Saints (CM Punk & Ace Steel) vs. Generation Next (Austin Aries & Roderick Strong) in a no-DQ match

ROH Tag Team Champions The Havana Pitbulls (Ricky Reyes & Rocky Romero) w/ Julius Smokes vs. Mick Foley's Ring of Hardcore (Dan Maff & BJ Whitmer) for the Tag Team Titles

Pure Wrestling Champion John Walters vs. Homicide w/ Julius Smokes for the Pure Wrestling Title

And the main event:
Jushin "Thunder" Liger & ROH Champion Samoa Joe vs. American Dragon & Low Ki

Plus The Carnage Crew, Special K, The Embassy, Allison Danger, Jay Lethal, Dunn & Marcos, etc.

NWA-TNA Victory Road 11/7/04 in Orlando, FL:

20-Man X-Division Gauntlet featuring Michael Shane, Frankie Kazarian, Hector Garza, Chris Sabin, Sonjay Dutt, Alex Shelley, Shark Boy, The Amazing Red, LA Park, Jerrelle Clark, etc

Raven vs. Abyss vs. Monty Brown

NWA Tag Team Champions Team Canada (Bobby Roode & Eric Young) vs. 3 Live Kru (BG James & Konnan) for the NWA Tag Team Titles

America's Most Wanted (Chris Harris & James Storm) vs. Triple X (Christopher Daniels & Elix Skipper) in a Last Team Standing match

TNA X-Division Champion Petey Williams vs. AJ Styles for the TNA X-Division Title

And the main event:
NWA Champion Jeff Jarrett w/ Scott Hall vs. Jeff Hardy w/ Kevin Nash in a Ladder Match for the NWA Title.

Plus Vince Russo & Dusty Rhodes find out who will be the Director of Authority, Roddy Piper hosts "In the Pit With Piper" with a surprise guest, etc.

Discuss. Is anyone planning on attending any of the shows? If not, is anyone planning on watching them at any point? Which show are you most looking forward to out of those of that weekend? What matches do you think will be the best? What will be the coolest moment, in your view?

Personally, I'm going to the 11/6 show which I'm pumped for. I've only seen 1 or 2 Liger match, but he's regarded as one of the greatest Jr. Heavyweight Workers of all time, so seeing him live is going to be so cool that it's unreal. I'll eventually see both ROH shows (since I'm a fan), but probably won't see the TNA PPV because I'm playing D&D that night. Since I'm attending the 11/6 show, I'm obviously looking forward to it most. However, I wish I could be there in Boston to see American Dragon vs. Jushin "Thunder" Liger live.

All three cards look excellent, though. From the TNA card, I'd most like to see the X-Division Guantlet at some point if possible because I love battle royal-esque things like that, and with the workers involved it should be great fun. Stytles vs. Williams is up there too. At the show I'm attending I'm really looking forward to the Tag Team Main Event putting three of the best young workers in the world in the ring with one of the greatest of all time. The crowd is going to be so hot for that match that it'll be unreal. The Pure Wrestling Title match should be excellent as well. John Walters could be more over, but he's a great technician, Homicide plays the psycho heel very well, and Julius Smokes is the most consistently entertaining (sometimes to the point that he's distracting) manager I've ever seen.

In short, it looks like next weekend will be a great time to be an indy wrestling fan whether you follow TNA, ROH, or both, as each promotion is putting on some really great stuff.

Thoughts?

Eric "Critic of the Dawn"
zackarcherPosted on 10/30/04 at 05:26:58

Two questions.

1. How do you guys normally watch ROH?  I mean, do I have to buy tapes to see the events?  How soon do they go on sale after they take place?  And where?

2. The 11/6 one is going to be at the Rexplex, right?  I was there over the summer for something, and I'm a little curious as to where they hold the event inside the building.  My guess would be the baskeball court but even that is rather small.

Critic of the DawnPosted on 10/30/04 at 10:03:12

1) Yeah, if you want to watch ROH you pretty much have to buy the tapes or DVDs if you're not there live.  It sounds like a bit of a rough deal until you realize you're getting a three hour show with matches that are consistently on par with the best anywhere in the world for $20 instead of the $40 WWE charges for one of their PPVs.  Tapes are usually released a month or so after the show is taped, and DVDs usually a bit afterwards.

2) The 11/6 show is in the Rexplex, yes.  I believe the show is probably held on the basketball courts - it's on the right not far inside the Rexplex, if that makes any sense at all.  The last show I went to at the Rexplex (which was also the first) had about 900 people in that space for Mick Foley's ROH debut, and it didn't seem too crowded.

Eric "Critic of the Dawn"
Critic of the DawnPosted on 11/06/04 at 18:27:41

Results of Weekend of Thunder Night One 11/5/04 in Boston, MA:

The show apparently drew in the neighborhood of 650-700 fans.

Jimmy Rave w/ Prince Nana & Angel Williams defeats Ace Steel via Pinfall after the Rave Clash in what was apparently a decent match.

Homicide w/ The Rottweilers defeats Angel Dust, Fast Eddie, & Dunn (substituting for Izzy) via Pinfall after the Cop Killa on Angel Dust.  A fun match, from what's reported.  During the match Homicide repeatedly picked on the Red Sox, which eventually pissed a "fan" off enough that he jumped the rail and tried to attack Homicide.  The Rottweilers made short work of him, with Low Ki kicking him silly.

The Carnage Crew (Loc & DeVito) defeated Mick Foley's Ring of Hardcore (Dan Maff & BJ Whitmer) in a Boston Streetfight via Pinfall after hitting a trashcan Conchairto on Whitmer.  This was a bloody match, with the teams actually brawling in the first row for a while.  Allison Danger begged Carnage Crew to continue beating up Maff and Whitmer after the match, but they blew her off.

Low Ki defeated Chad Collyer by Pinfall after a double foot stomp from the top rope.  This was said to be an OK match with excellent heel work by Low Ki, but not as good as the recent Ki vs. Lethal match in Philly.  Ki actually faked leg injury, which was so well done that some are thinking that it was an unplanned spot, as head booker Gabe Sapolsky was seen visibly freaking out as his main event for the next night was seemingly going up in smoke.  Naturally Ki was faking, and as Collyer helped him to the ropes, he ambushed him with a stiff kick to the stomach.

ROH Pure Wrestling Champion John Walters & Nigel McGuinness defeat ROH World Champion Samoa Joe & Jay Lethal via Submission with an Armbar variant by McGuinness to Lethal.  This was apparently a really fun match between guys from the Pure division and guys from the World division, so to speak.  The crowd was very behind Boston's own John Walters, and a confrontation between him and Joe was teased quite a bit.  After the match, Samoa Joe challenged Nigel McGuinness to a singles match the next time ROH comes to Boston on 1/15.

The Outkazt Killaz defeat several ROH students in a squash match.  Not much to be said, except the OCK are apparantly very underrated.

Austin Aries defeats CM Punk via Submission with a Half Boston Crab.  This was said to be a good back and forth match which focused on Aries working Punk's leg for most of the match.  Many are comparing Aries to AJ Styles in 2002, in that he seems to get more and more impressive each time he wrestles, and the fans can clearly see it and throw their support behind him.  After working the leg for the entire match, Aries hits the 450 Splash to Punk's legs, then locks in the half crab and forces Punk to tap out.  After the win, Aries gets on the mic and demands a shot at Samoa Joe's title for at least the second time.

ROH Tag Team Champions The Havana Pitbulls (Ricky Reyes & Rocky Romero) defeat Generation Next (Roderick Strong & Jack Evans) in an awesome match.  The actual decision isn't clear from the report I read, but there was apparently a spot where the referee counted a nearfall that everyone thought was a 3, resulting in a bullshit chant by the fans who were clearly behind Generation Next in this Heel vs. Heel match.  Evans is one of the best high-flyers today, and Strong is excellent as well with a sick variety of backbreakers, to the point that PWInsider called them similar to a 2004 version of Sabu and Taz.

Jushin "Thunder" Liger w/ Samoa Joe defeats "The American Dragon" Bryan Danielson via Pinfall with a Top Rope Brainbuster.  Liger got the biggest crowd reaction of the night, and this was reportedly a very good match that was a lot of fun.  Liger hit all his signiture spots, with the crowd eating them up with a spoon, going crazy for his Palm Strikes, etc.  The crowd was definately behind him despite the fact that American Dragon is a traditional fan favorite in ROH.

Sounds like a great show.  Makes me look forward to tonight's in New Jersey even more.

I'll post results of the other two events as I see them.

Eric "Critic of the Dawn"
Critic of the DawnPosted on 11/07/04 at 09:33:56

Results from Weekend of Thunder Night Two 11/6/04 from Elizabeth, NJ:

I'd estimate that there were between 1500 and 2000 in attendence, probably closer to 1500.

Chad Collyer drew Nigel McGuinness when the time limit expired.  This match started off slow but built up quite nicely and was pretty hot by the end.  Nigel is a very over guy, and is quite clearly on the rise in ROH.  Collyer... less so.  It actually looked as if Collyer had won this match, as he'd locked McGuinness in the Texas Cloverleaf, but the bell was for the draw, not a Collyer victory.  The crowd chanted "5 More Minutes!" but it was not to be.  There was a fun bit in the match where Collyer smashes McGuinness's fingers, so Nigel got a woman in the front row to kiss them better.  Nigel tried to re-enter the ring, but got a forearm to the face for his troubles.  Another kiss, this one to the cheek.  Nigel finally gets into the ring and crotches Collyer, who bails to the outside and heads for the same woman.  HAHAHA!  After the match, the two partners shook hands and all was well between them.  **1/2.

The Carnage Crew (Loc & DeVito) defeated the ROH Students (Andrews & Franco) via Pinfall with a Top Rope Spike Piledriver.  The students worked a pretty good match and even got a bit of offense, but once Carnage Crew got a little momentum things were over quickly.  Good stuff.  Post match, Allison Danger, still wearing her torn Prom Dress, begged Carnage Crew to join her and help her defeat Maff & Whitmer.  They refused, causing her to yell after them that they'd be sorry.  **

Izzy defeated Trent Acid, Jack Evans & Fast Eddie via Pinfall when Izzy hit a Top Rope Sitout Asai DDT on Trent Acid.  Very solid spotfest with great crowd reactions.  One notable spot was a Moonsault Fallaway Slam by Fast Eddie out of the ring to Jack Evans.  Really got the crowd hot for the rest of the show, and showed off some of ROH's best fliers.  Izzy's valet Lacey is very attractive and all, but I prefer Becky Bayless.  **

Jimmy Rave defeated Jay Lethal via Pinfall with the Rave Clash.  Lethal actually controlled the majority of this match, looking as impressive as always and just generally kicking a lot of ass.  Rave sold the match well, but the fact that he doesn't seem to have any facial expressions other than "mild concentration" really limit the degree to which he can interact with the crowd.  The match turned around when Prince Nana got on the microphone and started yelling advice to Rave.  The referee tried to stop him and Rave hit a low blow behind the ref's back, then the Rave Clash for the victory.  Oh, and Angel Williams, Rave's new valet, is gorgeous.  Nana spent a large portion of the match ordering her around, and actually had the Outcast Killaz spray air freshener around the ring and forced Williams to get on her hands and knees for Rave to use as a step during his entrance.  Great heel stuff.  **

The Second City Saints (CM Punk & Ace Steel) defeated Generation Next (Austin Aries & Roderick Strong) via Pinfall when CM Punk hit the Pepsi Plunge on Roderick Strong.  This was a no-DQ match, and Jack Evans interfered heavily.  The use of a ladder in this match along with table spots and chairs made this seem like a TLC match in all but name.  Great stuff here, with one notable moment being Evans hitting a 630 Senton off the top of a heavily damaged ladder in the ring to the outside.  Crazy, crazy stuff.  A few botched spots prevented this from being better.  ***1/2

Following the match, CM Punk called out Samoa Joe to demand a rematch, this time with no time limit.  Samoa Joe didn't show, so Punk said he wouldn't leave the ring until he got an answer.  After about a minute, MICK F'N FOLEY made a surprise appearance.  After schilling his book, Foley again said how impressed he was by Punk and Samoa Joe, and how when he eventually went back to WWE he hoped to take them with him.  Boos from the crowd.  Foley clarifies, stating that it's a crime that WWE fans have to watch talentless lugs like Heidenreich and Snitsky instead of world class athletes like Joe and Punk, and that they deserve better.  The crowd is still booing WWE.  Foley shrugs and says "Well, at least it's not TNA..."  Huge "FUCK TNA!" chants.  ROH fans are obviously still sore that TNA stole Styles and Daniels from them.  Foley puts over Punk, saying he's a great worker without man-made muscles or man-made breasts, which seem to be requirements for working in WWE at the moment, and says that since Joe won't come out and accept Punk's challenge, maybe he's Softcore... just like Ricky Steamboat.

Intermission.  Punk continues to sit in the ring, drinking some water and throwing the bottle at a redhead at ringside, reading Foley's book, talking on the phone, and teasing throwing the book to the crowd.  A friend of mine held up his keys and I shouted "He'll give you his car for it!"  Punk grinned and seemed inclined to accept, but my friend backed out of the deal.  After the intermission, Joe comes out and confronts Punk, then takes him down.  I *think* he accepted the match, but I'm not 100% sure.

The Ring Crew Express (Dunn & Marcos) defeat Special K (Dixie & Angel Dust) via Pinfall with the Assisted Senton.  I love Dunn and Marcos.  They rocked me like a hurricane.  **

ROH Pure Champion John Walters defeats Homicide via DQ.  This match was just getting going when Homicide slipped from the top rope during an attempt to set up a superplex of some sort and landed on his face on the outside.  From the looks of things, he suffered a concussion for sure.  The match stopped for several minutes while people tried to find out if he was okay.  Eventually the 20 count was started, but Homicide made it back into the ring.  The place where he landed was visibly pale.  Sick.  Homicide attempts to continue the match, but clearly is having problems, so Julius Smokes (probably at the request of Gabe the head booker, who was right there) ran in and broke up a submission attempt with a lariat, getting Homicide DQ'ed.  Post match, the Rottweilers beat down Walters while officials help Homicide to the back.  Here's hoping he's okay...  Considering what happened, I'm not rating this match.  If it had finished normally, it looked like it'd probably have been about ****, though.

ROH Tag Team Champions The Havana Pitbulls (Ricky Reyes & Rocky Romero) defeat Mick Foley's Ring of Hardcore (Dan Maff & BJ Whitmer) via Pinfall with a roll up after the Pitbulls pulled the old switcheroo.  Everyone seemed to be a bit off their game considering what had just happened, but Maff and Whitmer did their best to get the crowd going again by going for a series of impressive tag team finishers including the Doomsday Device and the Hart Attack.  Maff also teased a version of the People's Elbow, but hit a senton instead.  Good match, but it was a bit weak after what had happened.  Still, it got the crowd back.  **

Jushin "Thunder" Liger & Samoa Joe defeat "The American Dragon" Bryan Danielson & Low Ki via Pinfall when Jushin Liger hit the Running Liger Bomb on American Dragon.  The focus of this match was the interaction between Dragon and Liger, with Low Ki and Joe playing supporting roles.  The crowd was insanely hot for this match, and Liger played the face in peril very well.  Just great great stuff.  The ringwork wasn't anything revolutionary, and the match was a trifle formulaic, but everything was solidly done and a lot of fun.  Dragon makes a great heel, while Low Ki is even better.  Following the match, the Rottweilers try to attack American Dragon for costing Low Ki his chance to eventually get a shot at Joe, but Joe and Liger make the save.  ***1/2

Very good show.  There were quite a few markout moments and some very solid wrestling, but there was nothing that stood out as a potential MOTYC.

Anyway, it's late and I'm exhausted, so I'm going to bed.

G'night everybody!

Eric "Critic of the Dawn"
Critic of the DawnPosted on 11/08/04 at 19:47:05

Results of NWA-TNA Victory Road 11/7/04 in Orlando, FL:

No estimate as to the size of the crowd at this event that I can find.

Hector Garza won a 20-Man X-Division Guantlet Match by pinning Frankie Kazarian with a roll up.  According to PWInsider, here is the order of entries:

1. Frankie Kazarian 2. Sonjay Dutt 3. Puma 4. LA Park 5. Jerrelle Clark 6. Miyamoto 7. Michael Shane 8. Hector Garza 9. Nosawa 10. Mikey Batts 11. Alex Shelley 12. Matt Sydal 13. Sonny Siaki 14. Jason Cross 15. Shark Boy 16. Psychosis 17. D-Ray 3000 18. The Amazing Red 19. Spanky 20. Chris Sabin

Sabin, Kazarian, and Garza were the final three.  Also, Spanky eliminated Michael Shane, which could lead to a good series of matches because those two workers are very familiar with each other.

Pat Kenney, Johnny B. Bad, Ron Killings & Erik Watts defeated The Naturals (Andy Douglas & Chase Stevens), Kid Kash & Dallas via Pinfall when Ron Killings hit a Sithout Pedigree on Chase Stevens.  This was apparently a good match, but with no real buildup.  Tension between Kash & Dallas was teased after the match.

Mascarita Sagrada defeated Piratita Morgan via Pinfall with a Crucifix.  Apparently a fun match that the crowd really got a kick out of.

3 Live Kru (BG James & Konnan) defeated NWA World Tag Team Champions Team Canada (Bobby Roode & Eric Young) w/ Scott D'Amore via Pinfall when Konnan hit a Sitout Faceplant on Bobby Roode.  As a result, 3 Live Kru won the NWA World Tag Team Titles.  Lots of interference by D'Amore, but the James chased him off, allowing Konnan to get the pin.

Piper's Pit introduces "Superfly" Jimmy Snuka.  Kid Kash hits the ring after Piper claims Snuka is an X Division legend and lays out both Piper and Snuka with coconut shots with help from Michael Shane & Frankie Kazarian.  Sonjay Dutt tries to make the save, but is overwhelmed.  Finally, Piper was able to chase Kash away as officials cleared the ring.

Trinity w/ Glen Gilberti & Johnny Swinger) defeats Miss Texas (Jaqueline) via Pinfall with the Moonsault.  Apparently this was a good bout, which surprises me as I've never been a fan of Jaqueline's work.  Trinity gets the win after heavy interference by Gilberti and Swinger.

Monty Brown defeats Raven & Abyss via Pinfall when Brown Pounced Raven through a table.  From all accounts this was a very solid hardcore match using a variety of weapons that went all over the arena.  The crowd chanted for Foley when thumbtacks came into play - sorry guys.  ROH has Foley (who apparently showed up at Saturday's show as a surprise and worked the event for no charge - he then proceeded to watch the rest of the show from the balcony where the fixed camera was, but I digress).  Anyway, from everything I've heard, Brown is a future big name, and putting him over in this match was probably the right decision.

TNA X-Division Champion Petey Williams w/ Scott D'Amore defeated AJ Styles via Pinfall with a Canadian Destroyer from the Top Rope.  Williams retained the X-Division Title.  Styles looked very strong here, kicking out of a belt shot and surviving interference by D'Amore, but Williams was just too much for him, and after blocking a superplex Williams put Styles away with his finisher.

America's Most Wanted (James Storm & Chris Harris) defeated Triple X (Christopher Daniels & Elix Skipper).  James Storm was eliminated first after a chairshot by Daniels.  Daniels went down next after a Legdrop by Harris.  Harris finally picked up the victory after hitting the Catatonic onto a chaid on Skipper.  Post match, Triple X come back and beat down America's Most Wanted, restraining them with handcuffs and making them watch as their partners are destroyed.  Reportedly a good match that continues what is probably the best feud in TNA history, but not quite up to the standard of their past encounters.

NWA World Heavyweight Champion Jeff Jarrett w/ Scott Hall defeated Jeff Hardy in a ladder match.  As a result, Jarrett retained his title.  Again.  Heavy interference by Hall for most of the match, with Hardy managing to fight him off repeatedly.  The turning point came when Nash (who was supposed to be in Hardy's corner) arrived with two guitar... which, of course, Hall and Nash nailed Hardy with, allowing Jarrett to pick up yet another screwjob win.  Styles ran down for the save, but Jarrett, Hall and Nash fought him off.  3 Live Kru followed, but again they were defeated.  Suddenly Randy Savage made and appearance... and the show went off the air.

Looks like a very respectable PPV effort by TNA.  I've said before that I don't expect them to last all that much longer because they've never turned a profit, but if they can get a better timeslot for their TV show and promote PPVs of this quality, they MIGHT be able to turn their fortunes around.  Even though I'm a diehard ROH fan and watch WWE religiously, I think that a little competition at the top would be a positive for the business as a whole.

So... yeah.  This weekend was a great one to be a fan of Independant Wrestling.

Eric "Critic of the Dawn"